Not sure where to start

[Josh]

hello, I am new to the forum and wanted to say that I have scoured countless posts which independently have the same issues that I am currently experiencing. I have a 2014 B-52 21 with the 5.7l Indmar with 270 hours on her, and am the original owner.

I am decent with a wrench, and maintain my boat with a certain amount of love and believe that by doing so she has taken care of me trouble free for the past 6 summers minus some minor warranty work ie: shaft seal, steering wheel cover (fell off in my hands while kids were surfing), but that's it.

on the 4th of July the family and good friends took off to New Melones for a day on the lake, it was my first time there and I have to say that it is so much better than Folsom Lake. We hade a great day surfing, boarding, and tubing. after about a 15 minute ride 25-35mph from our play area to the dock I idled down due to the no wake zone and BAM Limp Mode. Not having dealt with this before I decided to read on the forums and attempt to self diagnose the potential issues. when I took the STBRD panel off to replace the fuel filter I looked down and noticed that my original motor mounts were not firm and standing tall like they were at the beginning of my season but rather short squished and tearing apart.

I put a fuel gage on the rail and when I fired her up I was getting roughly 72psi which is about 10psi to many, not really sure what to think I called up Larson Marine in Stockton (I will never go to Larson in Rancho Cordova again due to their service guy who is better than everyone else and is quite arrogant) to see about getting an appointment scheduled. Service told me to bring it down and that he would let me know what it was in the next day or so. Friday rolled around and still nothing. Wednesday the 15th and the mechanic told me that it was going to need a whole new fuel pump assembly which I could not order separate parts for because it was custom built specifically for MB. then I was told "its just the fuel pressure regulator and itll be here tomorrow" (in the tank of course). They replaced it and the engine runs like a top.

Now for the motor mounts. those were replaced on the 17th, no word on the 18th to come and get it. on the 21st still no definitive answer. yesterday I spoke with service and was told that they couldn't align the shaft to the engine due to...….. you guessed it a broken prop shaft. he said when they unbolted the coupler that it just fell apart. up to this point I haven't experienced any vibrations or anything that would lead one to think that something was a miss.

Maybe I am one of the fortunate ones here, maybe not, but any advice or suggestions on the topic would be greatly appreciated.

[AZ_MB]

Welcome to the forum Josh!

If you've read several threads about the motor mounts, there have been some people who replaced their mounts before their shaft broke. While they were glad to have gotten theirs done before having it break on the lake, they were then concerned about possible cracking due to the failed mounts and now their shaft was compromised and a ticking time bomb. Some people replaced them anyway just for the peace of mind.

All this to say, given your mounts were bad, it's not a bad idea to go ahead and replace the shaft too. It is surprising that your shaft broke in the shop and not on the water, but I'd try an get MB and your dealer to help you get it taken care of. I believe MB has been working with original owners to help them out. I'm not sure exactly what but give them a call. Hopefully they'll get you taken care of and you'll have the peace of mind knowing your mounts and shaft are all new. 

[Josh]

thank you AZ_

Ive sent MB as well as Indmar an email notifying them of the issue and hoping to get at minimum an acknowledgement that there is a possible design flaw whether it be in the engineering or materials.

after talking with the dealership, this occurrence only happens about once every 5 years. My service writer is saying it is all going to fall on my shoulders and my wallet will be the only thing getting lighter.

is there someone specific that I can speak with at MB?

 

[AZ_MB]

Got your PM Josh and am glad MB is working with you. For the sake of others who read this thread you might update it as things progress. 

[Josh]

Spoke with MB yesterday, and Mel said that the campaign for the bushings through Indmar had basically run its course. in 2014 or 15 Indmar apparently sent out emails to all of the dealerships asking them to contact the customers so the bushings could be replaced. He wasn't sure what if anything could be done from Indmar's position, but he was going to speak to the dealership about them contacting Indmar. As far as the shaft goes Mel said that he was going to try to take care of me. he wasn't sure how much or what he could do seeing as I am well beyond my warranty period.

more to follow as things progress.

thank you!!

[Josh]

A quick update. 7/29 I called the dealership to get a status update. I was kinda given the run around for about 30 minutes and when I asked if he had spoken to MB about my situation he said no. I then informed him a second time about the conversation Mel and I had about the shaft. I left Jake alone yesterday, but today was a whole other story. The wife and i drove down and after 24 days of the boat being in the shop I finally got to meet the young man in person. Apparently the service manager there quit memorial weekend there abouts and he has stepped up from the sales dept to fill in which makes since that everything is foriegn to him.

While in the service area we kindly asked Jake about the conversation he had with Mel and the response was, "if indmar will cover the bushings MB will cover the shaft" so im like cool, what'd they say? "I haven't spoke to them yet"

Wife: theres no time like the present, we'll wait.

Indmar will not warranty the mounts because of the length of time that has lapsed from the end of the campaign, but acknowledged that my engines serial number fell in the range of the recall. The last serial number is roughly 191xxx and mine is 185xxx.

MB is going to cover the shaft, not the labor which is still fantastic news considering Ive been out of warranty for some long years now.

@AZ_MB here is the old shaft. ARE 44.7 Elberts. Looks like quite a bit of heat build up in there. And you can kinda see the crack through the key way. 

[AZ_MB]

Crack right at the key way is where most of the others are as well.  Seems pretty weak that Indmar is saying too much time has passed.  I called them myself and was able to get the parts sent directly to me no charge.  You might try calling yourself since your service manager is new and seems to be learning still.  Doesn't hurt to try.

[steve142]

Yep, I called them direct, they covered the parts, MB covered half the labor. I had to pay for a prop shaft though, because when the pulled it apart, I had the crack in the key way.

[Josh]

Indmar was a no go on the bushings.

Finally picked up the boat yesterday, and was told that during installation the guys were having trouble using the PSS shaft seal. (Its only 6 years old) so they upgraded me to a Glide dripless seal.

Ive seen on another post about installing a safety collar so you dont lose the complete assembly should it break at the coupling. Any recommendations on a specific collar and how skinny do you need to be to install it? Any negatives about the glide seal?

Thank you

[Josh]

Here are pics of the port side that my wife sent me while loading up the boat for our long weekend. 29 days in shop.

Dealer told me my cushion backing was made of wood and thats what caused the staining/orange color.

Super dissapointed at this point.

Never again to Larsons Marine. On to the next stealership.

[Idavis]

I feel like Mel does everything in his power to make it right between MB and the owners! We’re you able to clean the rust stains off or is it permanent? Either way it sucks

[AZ_MB]

On 8/6/2020 at 5:06 AM, Josh said:

Indmar was a no go on the bushings.

Finally picked up the boat yesterday, and was told that during installation the guys were having trouble using the PSS shaft seal. (Its only 6 years old) so they upgraded me to a Glide dripless seal.

Ive seen on another post about installing a safety collar so you dont lose the complete assembly should it break at the coupling. Any recommendations on a specific collar and how skinny do you need to be to install it? Any negatives about the glide seal?

Thank you

The upgrade to the glide seal is a great bonus.  Did they charge you for that? Plenty of issues on here with the PSS seals leaking. 

[Josh]

Got the orange off, however we started the boat up to make sure everything was fine. Started great, and 3 seconds into it that damn beeping was back. 3k rpm max. Called the dealer on friday and brought it straight back. They jumped right on it and saw it was back at 72lbs pressure. I was told in the beginning of this shindig that the pressure switch didnt fix it so they changed out the pressure regulator, not true it was never touched. Got word yesterday that the regulator got it down to 58 psi but still throwing a code. They used a fuel pump assy from a Malibu and said that fixed the issue however they dont have the ability to get another one until next week. Do I have to replace the $750 assembly or can i just change out the actual pump only?

Anyone know about an aftermarket fuel pump or part number?

[oboyskibum]

The Boat Shack did an awesome job on my boat troubleshooting my limp mode issue (no codes on the motor) they just changed out my fuel sensor last week. No more limp mode for me. I have the 2014 6.0 L96 so its not quite the same but it might be worth a shot.

[Josh]

The fuel pressure switch and regulator have been changed out the only thing left in that assembly is the fuel pumps because there are 2 of them and the sock filter, which I am told by dealer that there is no individual parts, only the complete assembly. 

@oboyskibum I Called the Boat Shack in UT for advice and Justin over there was helpful to say the least, thank you.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Josh

[Josh]

Well, its been a minute or two since the last update. Dealership called today and informed me that MB did not have an available fuel pump assembly and I was told they did not know when one would become available, however they could get a used one from a wrecked boat at more than full price ~$800.... wtf.

Took someone else's advice and marched my happy ass down to O'Reilly auto and picked up 2 fuel pumps for ~$220, pulled out the assembly, patience is a virtue here. Cut the crimps on the fuel line (be careful not to break off the nipple on the pump) unplugged the fuel pumps and replaced in same order. Replaced the assembly, in doing so, I found that feeding the bolts through the top of the flange and through the gasket first really helps with alignment. Fired up the boat and wouldn't you know it flipping beep came right back on. Shut her down, fired it back up and woot woot back in business. There will be a follow up tomorrow after new melones. 

BTW:: heres the old bosch pumps, and the actual part numbers used. I really hope this helps someone else in the future. The pumps are both identical, no high pressure, low pressure here.

[Josh]

Well it turns out the pressure regulator was still no good. Got to the water and right out of the 5mph buoys limp mode.

Brought yhe old girl home and replaced the regulator with one from a 2004 ram 1500, granted there was no ground tab on it (theoretically there is no reason other than static buildup to have a ground because it is not attached to anything else metal, and nothing mechanical) fired her up, no beep, no stutter, no b.s. at this point, going out tonight, we shall see.

Thanks to all that have responded,  and especially to @AZ_MB, @oboyskibum, and the boat shack for solid sound advice.

Here is the regulator I used. And with veterans discount it was under $120 and at my O'Reilly parts store the next morning.

[Josh]

Running like a champ, no issues what so ever!!!

Rough water... 113° at 550 pm...

[AZ_MB]

Nice work! Glad she's up and running. I wish our lakes were that rough. 🤣 I'd actually be able to wakeboard without waiting until sunset. 

[Josh]

To be completely honest, at Folsom  Lake with no wind up one of the fingers it really is nice. The main body can be atrocious at times with white caps and 3' swells and only 10mph winds.

53 minutes ago, AZ_MB said:

Nice work! Glad she's up and running. I wish our lakes were that rough. 🤣 I'd actually be able to wakeboard without waiting until sunset. 

 I will be attaching a stainless steel hose clamp to the fuel pressure regulator and attaching the ground to that

[Josh]

Here is photos of the fuel pumps on the ohmmeter.  The one at 2.6 is normal (if you look you can see the nipple that attaches to the fuel line was broken off during clamp removal), but the other at 49.1 looks like it was in an open loop sending a higher voltage to the computer and contributing to the limp mode. 

@oboyskibum is having the same issue, hopefully he reports back with good results in the next day or so.

 

[bloodiestcadaver]

That is quite a bit of resistance. If anything it would send lower voltage. but none the less, lower fuel pressure/volume can create a lean condition, which the computer would put in limp mode for protection purposes. Great find!

[Josh]

9 minutes ago, bloodiestcadaver said:

That is quite a bit of resistance. If anything it would send lower voltage. but none the less, lower fuel pressure/volume can create a lean condition, which the computer would put in limp mode for protection purposes. Great find!

the shop was saying it was a higher voltage, I may be wrong in what I heard. Just super happy I can get on the water with no concerns at this point. other than the nor cal wild fires, this sucks..

And I am hoping that my adventure will help others in the same position.

[bloodiestcadaver]

1 hour ago, Josh said:

the shop was saying it was a higher voltage, I may be wrong in what I heard. Just super happy I can get on the water with no concerns at this point. other than the nor cal wild fires, this sucks..

And I am hoping that my adventure will help others in the same position.

I guess its possible, but generally higher resistance, same voltage supply would cause amperage to go up. And usually you get a large "voltage drop" from high resistance( example would be a corroded wire causing high resistance and will cause low voltage supply to a circuit.  But electricity is explained only in a Theory, because there are many unexplained variables 

[Josh]

58 minutes ago, bloodiestcadaver said:

I guess its possible, but generally higher resistance, same voltage supply would cause amperage to go up. And usually you get a large "voltage drop" from high resistance( example would be a corroded wire causing high resistance and will cause low voltage supply to a circuit.  But electricity is explained only in a Theory, because there are many unexplained variables 

The fuel pressure was still high, I don't really understand why they'd put 2 fuel pumps in a system which only requires 55-62psi for successful operations. One might think with the advancements in technology that the computer would just shut down the bad part and then throw a code that says "hey dummy change fuel pump A" but its all good, thank you.

hopefully the smoke clears here so I can enjoy New Melones this weekend.